Cargo Harness Fit

[MonsterMom6]

My DD is 6.5, 35# and rides in a Graco Cargo. She is very close to outgrowing the top slot on her harness.

What would be the safer option- keep her in Cargo with her shoulders slightly above the top slots until she gains more weight or put her in a Monterey?

I would have a very hard time justifying the expense of a harnessed seat that would fit her torso height to DH. Also, she is a quadruplet and the other 3 will all be in Montereys (when they come off backorder). They are all over 40# now and riding in Air Boosters and Parkway.

I drive a high top conversion van. We have size on our side, but no side curtain airbags or other nifty safety features in the rear cabin.

I could play musical seats with the others if another HBB would be a better choice for her. We have Air Boosters, a Parkway, a Turbo.

Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

[mommaon112903]

I personally would never use a harness when the shoulders are above the last harness slot. The seats were not crash tested this way, so who knows what would really happen if an accident were to happen. This is just my :twocents: and a tech may feel differently.

Josef is in a Monterey in Daddy's car and you can see his stats in my siggy. He was 42lbs when we first put him in it, and we are hanging steady at 36lbs still :( I just posted a question last week about weight loss, and the consensus was that as long as he fit properly, which he still does, he is perfectly safe in his booster. I would yank him out in a heartbeat though if it were not fitting him well however. He :love: his Monterey and wants one in Momma's car too.

I :love: :love: :love: everything about the Monterey! I like that it is deeper than the Turbo, it is LATCHable and sooooo soft/comfy. Like I said before Josef fits GREAT in it and unless Britax comes out with something awesome, he will get another Monterey for my car when he outgrows the Regent (sooner than later with the way he grows in his torso).

[Maedze]

At 6.5 I would put her in the Monterey and not worry too much about it.

[MonsterMom6]

I personally would never use a harness when the shoulders are above the last harness slot. The seats were not crash tested this way, so who knows what would really happen if an accident were to happen. This is just my :twocents: and a tech may feel differently.


That's what I thought, but then I was chatting with my friend who had her triplets in Marathons until just about their 7th birthday. One is a bit tall in the torso and she spoke with someone at Britax that assured her that her DD could continue to safely use the seat as long as her ears were not past a certain spot on the shell, regardless of how the harness fit. I think she spoke to 3 different people at different times, just to get as much time out of her seats as she could.

So that 's what got me thinking. And I know I could call Graco and will, but from what I've read here, I could get 3 different answers.

[Judi]

Still wouldn't do it. I would go with the Monterey.

[Maedze]

Customer Service reps at car seat companies tend to be quite ignorant of the product and also tend to give out dangerous advice.

If the advice contradicts the manual, it's bad. Neither Britax nor Graco allows seats to be used beyond the uppermost harness position.

[Mommy0608]

I agree with everyone else. At 6.5 I'd be comfortable with her in a booster as long as she is able to sit properly in it for the whole ride.

Just to add, the reason that it's dangerous to use a harness when the child's shoulders are above the top slots is that it creates a risk of spinal compression. The harness could put downward pressure on the child's shoulders during a crash.

I also agree that the person answering the phone will not always have the correct information, unfortunately. :(

[MonsterMom6]

Just to add, the reason that it's dangerous to use a harness when the child's shoulders are above the top slots is that it creates a risk of spinal compression. The harness could put downward pressure on the child's shoulders during a crash.

:(

Thanks, Mommy0608. About 5 years ago when I was researching RA replacements, I got a chance to see a Recaro combo seat IRL. I found a local racing company that could order the seat in and the guys were super nice, letting me try it out on my 2 biggest kids at the time. Can't remember the name of the seat now, but it was UBER nice. Would have invested in them if the BPB worked on my van, but it didn't position the shoulder belt right.

Anyhoo....I was chatting with the racing the guy, who was also kind enough to show my critters the race car. He's a tall guy and we were talking about the harnesses that they use. He knew nothing about car seats for kids but he did say that the harness on this particular car was too low for him and he was VERY sore for a VERY long time when he got in a wreck. He actually felt his shoulders being pulled down. Now, for him, it kept him from bouncing around the car, which was likely preferable.

So, I guess we are just taking our chances that we'll have the least serious injury in the most likely accident????

I DO feel better about the Monterey versus the other HBB options that we have. Especially absent side curtain air bag.

[Mommy0608]

Perhaps someone else will be able to explain this more clearly, but in your example of the race car driver with the harness below his shoulders, I'm guessing that a properly fitting harness that was AT his shoulders or slightly above would also prevent him from "bouncing around the car" while driving or in a crash. Now I don't really have knowledge of race car driving so maybe there's something different that factors into how their harnesses fit vs. kids in car seats.

In a car seat (and maybe a race car, I don't know), there are straps holding the hips/thighs down as well, so having the harness just slightly above the shoulder likely won't be a problem in a crash. Personally, I'd rather have the straps at or above while forward-facing to prevent spinal compression, even if it means my child could maybe slide up a bit in the seat. Again, the straps at the thighs will be holding the child down, so if it's properly tightened, it won't allow enough slack for the child to slide up, such as what you may be picturing in a rollover or other unlikely crash.

You mentioned least injury in most likely scenario... I suppose there could be some truth to that, but I don't think that having the harness above the shoulders is unsafe in other unlikely crash scenarios, provided the harness is adjusted to the proper tightness.

[Pixels]

The lap straps will keep the child down. The shoulder straps are to keep the upper body back, not down. No taking chances. ;)

[Mommy0608]

The lap straps will keep the child down. The shoulder straps are to keep the upper body back, not down. No taking chances. ;)

:yeahthat:

[MonsterMom6]

The lap straps will keep the child down. The shoulder straps are to keep the upper body back, not down. No taking chances. ;)

I was thinking about the difference between DD being in BPB vs 5-point when I mentioned "taking our chances that we'll have the least serious injury in the most likely accident". I guess depending on crash type it's like choosing between possibly being compressed at the shoulders (outgrown 5-point) vs possibly being thrown about (BPB). And using a BPB with SIP would help to contain the child in the event of a side impact crash, and possibly a rollover???

OK, maybe I'm over analyzing this. So far you all agree that absent a larger 5-point booster, she would be better off in a properly fitting BPB than the the outgrown Cargo harness. And it seems that the Monterey would be a better choice for her than the other boosters that I currently have.

Thanks to all of you for your input. I'll just keep a ruler in the glove box and regularly check that harness.

[Mommy0608]

I was thinking about the difference between DD being in BPB vs 5-point when I mentioned "taking our chances that we'll have the least serious injury in the most likely accident". I guess depending on crash type it's like choosing between possibly being compressed at the shoulders (outgrown 5-point) vs possibly being thrown about (BPB). And using a BPB with SIP would help to contain the child in the event of a side impact crash, and possibly a rollover???

You say possibly being thrown out of a BPB... children who are old enough, big enough and mature enough to properly use and fit in a BPB are safe. We actually don't have solid proof that a child who properly fits a BPB by age, maturity and size is any less safe in a BPB than a harness. A properly fitting booster will position the lap belt low on the thighs, and the shoulder belt across the shoulder between the neck and edge of the shoulder. The low lap belt will work to hold the child down, much like the hip portion of a 5-point harness. Of course, a seat belt doesn't have a crotch buckle, but if the child fits in the booster properly it's not an issue. The shoulder portion of the seat belt holds the child's torso back, just like the shoulder straps of a harness.

This isn't a matter of taking chances between a booster and an outgrown harness... using a booster that is appropriate for your child is definitely safer than using a harnessed seat when she has outgrown it.

Like you said, just keep an eye on her torso height. When her shoulders are over the top slots, she has outgrown it, and it's time for either a booster or a harnessed seat with taller slots.

Kudos to you for wanting to make sure your child is as safe as possible. :thumbsup:

[Stretchy Glue]

When my dh raced mini-sprints, the harnesses ALWAYS came from below their shoulders. It was actually in the club rules. I don't know why, I don't understand it, but the dynamics are quite different. In most racecars, the harnesses are anchored to the floor. Even in Nascar the harnesses are right at, but coming from the floor in most situations.