Is this child big enough for her booster?

[wendytthomas]

Obviously she's not mine. She's only five and has been in a backless for a long while now. And I don't think she's 40 pounds yet (maybe 34-36?). She JUST turned five a couple of weeks ago. I don't feel right giving advice without CPST next to my name, so I'm waiting (if her mom asked I'd give it in a heartbeat, but just going up to her and broaching it is another story). I'm wondering, though, if she's tall enough for it. I don't think so, but her neck and shoulder are so tiny that it's hard for me to tell. I do know that when Piper rode in her friend's cousin's booster when we needed to take her friend to the clinic for a head wound Piper's torso was long enough and the belt was right over her shoulder where it should be. Shocked me, for sure. My tiny little thing is tall enough for a backless (but not mature nor heavy, nor does her mommy have any desire for one). Boosters are not my strong point.

And obviously I don't take her in my car often. If I did I'd probably move my daughter over. These two next to each other for more than two minutes would probably not be a good thing (no shoulder belt in the middle otherwise she'd go there). Actually, if she went in my car a lot I'd install Piper's Radian for her. Tough cookies if she doesn't normally use one.

Anyway, what's the verdict? My gut says, regardless of her low weight, she's not yet tall enough for a backless. A high back that is rated to 30 pounds maybe (this one is a graco something, backless), but ideally a harnessed seat. I know she used to have a Roundabout. I saw it once in their car while they drove around the neighborhood and stopped to talk to us. I saw the whole thing since she was between her mom and dad hanging onto the captain's chairs of their minivan. :-( Obviously not a family that ranks safety very highly. Or perhaps the mom, who is very nice, is completely uneducated and ignorant. It wouldn't surprise me. She's not firing on all cylinders as it is.

http://www.baz.com/wendy/piper/pipertatyanacar.jpg

Thanks

Wendy

[scatterbunny]

If it's a Graco backless, the minimum weight limit is 40 pounds. And backless boosters get misused a lot because people don't use the clip that adjusts the shoulderbelt properly.

That little girl is not safe like that, IMO. :(

http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2005-09/chop-htb090905.php

Maybe that study on highback boosters versus lowback boosters would convince the parents to at least put her into a highback, if not back into a harnessed seat?

[Unregistered]

OT but I would be very upset if I found out a neighbor had posted a picture of my child on the internet, regardless of the reason. After you get the answer you are looking for - I suggest you remove the picture. A more prudent thing to do would have been to e-mail a photo to one of the techs you are friendly with if you really felt you needed a 2nd opinion.

I personaly wouldn't put a photo of my child on a public website.

[Jennifer]

She does not look safe like that. I agree with Scatterbunny. If you can't get them to put her in a harnessed seat, at least get her in a booster. The shoulder belt does not fit correctly. Can you get them to take her to a safety seat check like that? They will deffinately point out the dangers to the parents.

[wendytthomas]

I was able to talk to her mom a bit after I posted. When she came to pick the seat up (both times I've had her in my car have been unplanned where I've taken her home from the pool, or taken her home from lunch, both in our developments, so the choices were her booster or nothing) I asked if it had a back. I pointed to where it looked like something attached on. Then my eye caught the bottom where the cautions are and sure enough she'd be ok with a high back but not the backless. So I told her mom and told her that the seatbelt goes across her neck and would be BAD in an accident. Her mom said that because her nephew (six months younger) is in a backless (sigh, though he's probably heavy enough) her daughter threw a fit. Well, tough would have been my reaction. But my neighbor is not exactly strict, or consistent, even to the point where safety is a concern. I said that I wouldn't have gone anywhere, and she pointed out she needed to pick up her older son, he couldn't wait at school. So yes, she's in a tougher spot than I would be, but I would have made my older son wait, called my husband home from work, a friend, someone to get my son, and not left the house with my daughter for days.

I don't think getting through to her will work, but she homeschools like I do, and her daughter is here a lot, so maybe I can "do school" with both of them one day and educate the daughter to the risks. Do like Tiffany does and have a crash day in my living room and try to toss them out of the different seats (I can quickly set the radian up, it's out in the garage, and I have two backless boosters myself for emergencies that I can bring in and toss them out of).

Sigh. I live in a pretty affluent area, they can afford a seat for her. She's adopted, she's very much wanted, and yet they're not keeping her as safe as can be.

Wendy

[wendytthomas]

She does not look safe like that. I agree with Scatterbunny. If you can't get them to put her in a harnessed seat, at least get her in a booster. The shoulder belt does not fit correctly. Can you get them to take her to a safety seat check like that? They will deffinately point out the dangers to the parents.

She's in a backless in that photo, a graco. It's just not visible under her.

Wendy

[scatterbunny]

So because another child is in a backless, and her child threw a fit and wanted one, she thinks her child should be in a backless, too? Ugh. :( So sad that a little girl's tantrum is enough to get her parents to put her in an unsafe position.

Can you get the mom to visit this board?

[wendytthomas]

OT but I would be very upset if I found out a neighbor had posted a picture of my child on the internet, regardless of the reason. After you get the answer you are looking for - I suggest you remove the picture. A more prudent thing to do would have been to e-mail a photo to one of the techs you are friendly with if you really felt you needed a 2nd opinion.

I personaly wouldn't put a photo of my child on a public website.

I blacked out her face.

Wendy

[wendytthomas]

So because another child is in a backless, and her child threw a fit and wanted one, she thinks her child should be in a backless, too? Ugh. :( So sad that a little girl's tantrum is enough to get her parents to put her in an unsafe position.

Can you get the mom to visit this board?

Like I said, this lady is nice, sweet, a decent friend, a great neighbor, but not exactly an enforcer or the most researched lady.

I don't know if she could get here, and I definitely don't know how to suggest it without putting her on the spot. She is going to look into getting the back put on (which isn't ideal, but then it's at least made for her daughter's size). I don't know if she needs to be inundated with how wrong she is, I don't think it'll do any more good than one neighbor saying it, kwim? She's that kind of lady. And she is someone I would trust to drive around Piper if I installed Piper's seat.

Maybe what I'll do, since there are so many kids in my area, is help set up a seat check once I'm certified, and kind of beg my immediate neighbors to come (two of which I've spoken to about their kids in seats, another who is just 4 and 32 pounds and in a highbacked booster so should be talked to) and tell them I'm worried no one will come, can I at least do theirs, oh please? Will they at least come and make it worth while? There's a brand new fire station less than a mile from here, so I wonder if I could use their space, and maybe work with some techs who work there (and if none do then give them my name so if people call them asking for seat checks they can refer).

Wendy

[Unregistered]

I think a neighbor seat check is a great idea.

It is tough to see child seats improperly installed or misused, But it is very difficult to convince parents that there is a problem. The few times I've tried, I walked away from the encounters feeling bad and like I had done something wrong.

I take some comfort from this study. Even a badly installed car seat provides some protection...

Researchers at Children's Hospital of Philadelphia found children between 2 and 6 were 28 percent less likely to be killed in a crash if they were sitting in the back in either a car seat or booster seat instead of in a seat belt.

Even when considering "gross misuse" - such as cases where the child seat was not attached to the vehicle's seat or the child wasn't wearing the seat's harness - the risk of death was reduced by 21 percent, the study found.

Regarding

[scatterbunny]

A neighborhood seat check would be really cool!

If she puts the back on the booster that would be awesome. A 5yo, 30-something-pound child in a highback booster isn't so bad. She's old enough to sit properly, most likely (we hope). And she's at least within the weight limit of the highback.

[melaniev]

she's WAY too short. but obviously you already know that! my 9yo fits great in her backless booster - I'll post or send you a pic if you want. make it show and tell - "see this is how a child SHOULD fit in that seat!"