WWYD - using booster and 4 pt harness....

[monzogary]

Ok, dh is building a street legal dune buggy, with front bucket seats and space for two back passengers. For now, we want to put harnessed seats there for our two youngest, most likely the Nautilus. The only thing is that when they outgrow the harnesses on the Nautilus, we still want more protection than it would give with it as a booster and just a lap/shoulder belt. We have 4 point harnesses similar to this:
http://i9.ebayimg.com/04/i/000/aa/1e/2547_12.JPG

Would you feel comfortable using an after market racing harness like this with the Nautilus? The buggy will not really have a back seat per se, just a place to attach the seats so the Nautilus would actually be acting like the seating area, KWIM? We don't have room for much back there, but want to have the option of the girls riding in it for as long as we own it (maybe forever lol!). At least if we can use the Nautilus harnessed now, and with a 4 pt harness later, then they should be ready for nearly full size racing seats after that. With a 6 yr life span for the seats, even Laura would be 10+ and I'm sure we can find racing seats to fit them with the 4 pt harness by then.
Ok, so lots if information and rambling here, but bottom line, would you use the 4 pt with the Nauti?

[AdventureMom]

No, I would not do it. What I would do is just start out with regular racing seats (buckets w/side protection) and 5-pt racing harnesses.

[monzogary]

From what I have looked at so far, it seems that the racing seats are too big for them yet (even the youth ones) as Laura is only 4 and even though Heather is 7, she is on the small side (under 3rd percentile for height). Is there a reason why you would not at least use the Nauti with harness until they outgrow them? Just looking for opinions here, as dh wants me to find a Nauti to buy so he can get precise measurements. As a bonus, I would have more extra seats if we get Nautis lol.

[Gypsy]

No, I would not either.

It hasn't been tested or approved.

You would be installing seats in unapproved locations going completely against manufacturer instructions.

Nothing about any of that sounds safe or ok to me, not any of it.

If you had actual seats back there you could use the 86Y with a booster -- EZ-On has tested that set-up, but no, I wouldn't use ANY other harness with a booster and I wouldn't use ANY seat on the set-up you have going on.

[monzogary]

Nothing about any of that sounds safe or ok to me, not any of it.

...and I wouldn't use ANY seat on the set-up you have going on.

So you wouldn't even want to use the Nautilus at all? Why is that? This will be a licensed road vehicle, and will have lap belts and tethers at the very least to attach the seats. We just have too little room between the roll cage to add anything more than is necessary to fit the 4 of us in. We have seats for the front that will have 4 pt harnesses for 2 adults (racing seats that have the holes near the shoulders for the harness to route through). Is it just because there is no actual seat to install the Nautilus on? The only difference I can see is that there will be no compressible foam to set the seats on and have to squish down to get the seats installed tightly. I know the manufacturer doesn't specifically allow it, because it hasn't been tested, but my dh is an automotive engineer and I trust that he can make the vehicle crash worthy. I'm not trying to incite a riot here, lol, just trying to feel out others' points of view. :D
Thanks!

[AdventureMom]

A couple of reasons:

1 - on a hard surface with no foam, the seats could break apart in a crash, perhaps causing additional harm to the child in them

2- the seat will elevate them even higher than normal; in a vehicle like that, you probably want their heads as low as possible (I feel the same way about our Jeep Wrangler)

3 - car seats are meant to have support, not *be* the support, in a crash.

If you can't find a racing seat that will fit your children, then install a regular bench seat, get an 86Y-harness, and use it with a strong booster such as the Recaro Start. And I'd install a heavy duty tether anchor. :twocents:

(I still feel that they would be safer in racecar seats, even if the seats are slightly large for them. Heck, if he's going to try to attach a *plastic* carseat to the dune buggy, then why not drill extra holes to modify a youth racing seat so that the racing harness will fit correctly?)

[AdventureMom]

Have you looked here?

http://www.thejoieofseating.com/youth_race-seat.html

http://www.thejoieofseating.com/images/youth-race-seat_00a.jpg

Or something like this child bench seat for buggies/karts?

http://www.superstardirect.net/photos/seat_kids_double_red_4.JPG

[monzogary]

Thank you for your replies, I really do appreciate them. I was looking for opinions and reasons why people have that opinion, as it gives us more than just our perspectives on it. You have given me things to think about as we design the interior of the buggy. Thanks!!

[azgirl71]

If your children will be in the back harnessed in GN's then DH will need a bench seat and needs to put lap belts to install the GN's. Then when they out grow the harness on the GN's he will need to install new harness racing harnesses or a Y86. You cannot use racing harnesses to install a GN or any other car seat. I would probably also switch to custom racing seats once they are not in the GN's.

[monzogary]

IYou cannot use racing harnesses to install a GN or any other car seat.

I definitely would not be installing the seats with the racing harness, the seats will be installed with actual lap belts and tethers. There will be separate support for the the seats in back of some kind, just not sure exactly what we're doing yet. I am going to go to another WalMart today to see if I can pick up a Nauti so we can get measurements and see just how much space we would have to work with. I really do appreciate everyone's input; keep it coming!

[azgirl71]

I definitely would not be installing the seats with the racing harness, the seats will be installed with actual lap belts and tethers. There will be separate support for the the seats in back of some kind, just not sure exactly what we're doing yet. I am going to go to another WalMart today to see if I can pick up a Nauti so we can get measurements and see just how much space we would have to work with. I really do appreciate everyone's input; keep it coming!

Ok i was not sure. I do recommend them being installed on a bench seat even one like Maria posted would be fine.

[beebear23]

My FIL & BIL have street legal dune buggies that they have built. The kids ride in their car seats either in the front seat using the 3 point seatbelt that FIL installed, or in the back bench with lap belts(and their car seats). Any kid in a booster rides in the front seat w/the seatbelt. And my kid isn't allowed to go over 35 MPH in it! Most of the streets FIL goes on are 25 MPH.

[joolsplus3]

Well, I voted yes, in case anyone was wondering who was the crazy one. Of course, the assumption is that you can tell things are in tightly, and won't do anything stupid. I figure the carseats job is to keep the child attached to the car, and you'll know if it seems right.

Don't sue me if anything goes wrong, of course! :p

[monzogary]

Just for fun, I took a photo of the frame of the buggy. This is the best shot I could get in the confined space of the garage lol. The seats in the frame are our front buckets, and of course they will not be sideways like that :rolleyes:. About where you see the yellow string is where the back of the back seating area will be. It is quite skinny with only about 38" across to work with between the frame posts. There will be aluminum for the body on the bottom half of the buggy and it will be totally enclosed for use year round. The top will probably be some type of heavy canvas or something similar like what would be used for Jeep tops. There will also be another roll bar going vertically on the sides where the widest point is, near the front seats. As you can see, we have a lot of design and engineering work to do yet! Everything can be changed until its welded in.
Thanks again for the feedback! All is welcome!
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[monzogary]

So I picked up a Nauti yesterday. Dh did a test fit to see just how much space we will have to work with. The front driver's seat is about where it will be, just a tad higher and more forward, and the Nauti will be a little higher on a small bench (not very tall, it will be bolted directly to the floor). I just took a few quick pics while he was playing around, and yes Laura is not totally buckled in the one pic. I am feeling good about the fact that the Nauti has a metal bars running up the back or the seat. That will give the seat itself more stability in a crash on top of whatever protection and support the bench its on will have. I made sure dh was on board with a bench, and he already was. I also showed him the tether anchors from EZ-On. So we are on our way to making the buggy safe for the girls (well the two youngest anyway, the teenager can ride in front LOL).
Thanks again for all your replies!
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