Car Seat Woes - Who wants to play 20 questions (Long post!)

[TSquared]

DH is opposed to buying a dedicated infant/newborn seat since there seem to be safe convertible options that we could use from birth. (We have more of a walking lifestyle than a car lifestyle.) I spent hours (days even!) researching for a safe convertible option for a newborn that would fit RF in our Jetta….and now I’m at the end of my rope..please help!

We purchased the Radian 65 (low harness slots) and planned to get the infant insert that now comes with the 80. I just had it checked out by a car seat tech in our area, and he said that even with our front passenger seat all the way forward, it doesn’t quite make it to the 45 degree angle in our ‘99 Jetta. He suggested that we get an infant seat and keep the Radian, and turn DC FF when he reaches 1 year and 20 lbs. (!) He in fact mentioned that he moved his daughter FF at 9 months because developmentally she was okay to be FF. :eek: He was a nice guy, but now I’m not so sure I trust his judgment that much.

I would like to keep our child RF as long as possible, of course, but also would like to keep the Radian. I like its slim design, the fact that it works well for airline travel, and that we’ll be able to use it until our child is 5 or 6 years old.

Is there a way we can actually check the exact angle of the car seat other than by sight or a folded up piece of paper? If the seat is, say, 3 degrees shy of the requirement, would it be okay, or is the 45 degree limit pretty much set in stone?

If the seat must be at exactly 45 degrees, looks like we’re now back to the infant seat –unless I’m missing something?? Assuming that a Graco SafeSeat will even fit in our car (and I’m not so sure about this, based on a review I saw online by a Jetta owner), do you think it’s possible we would be able to RF with a SafeSeat until we can use the Radian FF?

Or if the SafeSeat doesn’t fit, if we purchase a Snugride, or similar, do you think it’s possible we’d be able to RF with the Radian at the 30 degree angle when DS grows out of the Snugride? I believe I read in my research somewhere that the Radian only works RF at 45 degrees, but it looks to me that you can adjust the seat to different angles. The 30 degree option with the Radian after a smaller infant seat may be a good for us since (I think) the front passenger seat wouldn’t ever need to be all the way up, but, again, I don’t know how I actually can verify when we have the Radian at 30 degrees.

Now, when DH gets home from work and we talk about this, I’m sure he’s going to want other convertible options, which I believe takes us back to the new Evenflo Triumph Advance. (I’m not really interested in the Cosco Scenera.) I assume the Evenflo will be a lot less convenient for air travel – anyone know? Are there any other car seats that are convenient for air travel other than the Radian?

Any other suggestions or ideas that I’ve overlooked? If you're still with me after all that, thanks!!:D

[bensmom]

Hmmm... are you sure that the person who checked your seat is a tech and not just being "helpful"? Either way, you're right not to trust his judgment.

The 45 degree recline is pretty important for a newborn. The Radian is a pretty tough seat for RF for a newborn because it's back is so tall, so the seat in front of it has to be really forward. It's also harder to make it more upright as the child gets older. You must use that foot for RF. The angle adjustment on the seat itself is for FF only. I haven't traveled with mine, but I find it pretty heavy (although others really like it for travel). Do they sell the infant insert that comes with the 80 for the 65? (I don't know, I haven't checked).

Personally, I'd probably go with an infant seat or a different convertible. Either way, I'd probably return the Radian for now (not worth wasting its "useful life"). I haven't seen thew new Evenflo yet, so I don't know if it works well with newborns. The Britax Roundabout might be a decent option for a newborn (a bigger Britax might work too, but you'd need to try it). It's not too bad for travel, it's easy to install, and it's not as tall, so it should fit RF pretty well. Mine worked for my tall DS until he was about 3 (RF to 2, then FF to almost 3 when DS2 needed it). At that point, the Radian might be a good option.

Others on here also know more about the new Recaro seats. I'm not sure if one of them would be good for a newborn.

[AdventureMom]

You may want to try an Uptown or Scenera. The Uptown is quite cushy and also has EPS foam; the Scenera is more utilitarian and does not have EPS foam. But both are safe and will do the job of keeping your child RF, probably to the RF limit of the seat. These seats do not have a base and aren't as 'tall' as the Radian, so they should work in your Jetta. There also may be other seats that will work as well.

I wouldn't keep the Radian unless you have another vehicle to put it in. If you return it and purchase one when you're ready to turn your child FF, then you haven't wasted 3 yrs or so of the useful life of the seat since seats do have expiration dates.

Hope this helps... :)

[papooses]

12 months + 20# is the bare minimum to turn a child FF ... newborns need the full 45 degree recline angle to allow them to breath, but anything between 30-45 degrees is safe for a toddler/preschooler: the longer your child stays RF (within the limits of the seat) the safer your child will be!

The Radian has a 6 year lifespan. If I were you, I'd probably exchange it for a Graco SafeSeat Step 1 (assuming it fits the vehicle) & plan on buying another Radian in the future. You don't have to carry your child in the SS1, but it fits kids the longest of any infant seat. This means you can keep the seat itself at room temp longer for comfort in extreme weather. You can also keep various bases installed in any spare vehicles to make transfering easier/safer (uninstalling + reinstalling can increase risk of misuse when in a rush, etc.) Also, the SS1 can be installed without the base in an emergency & it's easier to use for travel than any convertible, IMO.

Another idea is simply to have 1 adult sit in the backseat. This way you can move the front passenger seat forward to accomodate the Radian at a 45 degree recline & the back is safer for everyone, regardless of age + the child may be entertained/soothed easier.

[Susan in MI]

Where were you installing the Radian? Did you try it with the seatbelt in the center so the seat back could go between the two front seats? My dh has a Jetta and it is really tight in there. I'm thinking that even an infant seat would push the front seat too far forward unless you put it in the center. You do not have to use LATCH to install, and cannot use LATCH in the center position on the Jetta.

I put one of our seats rf in there, I think it was the MA, but I didn't try to get the 45 degree angle as my kids are all older, and too heavy to rf anyway. :( There isn't much room between the front seats so center may not work either but it's worth a try. Dh is gone with his car now, or I'd go give it a shot.

I agree with looking at the Scenera or Uptown. We have the Scenera in our Jetta and it gives us much more room than the MA. We have to put 3 kids back there so a seat that takes little space is important.

[Patriot201]

and turn DC FF when he reaches 1 year and 20 lbs. (!) He in fact mentioned that he moved his daughter FF at 9 months because developmentally she was okay to be FF.

:eek: I am horrified! I am so glad you know better! Yikes!

I would like to keep our child RF as long as possible, of course, but also would like to keep the Radian. I like its slim design, the fact that it works well for airline travel, and that we’ll be able to use it until our child is 5 or 6 years old.

How about a Scenera for now? It is $40 at Wal-Mart (even cheaper if you can find a clearanced one at Target) and will be a good seat until your child is able to sit in the Radian. It will then be a good back-up seat.

do you think it’s possible we would be able to RF with a SafeSeat until we can use the Radian FF?

It truly depends on the size of your child. I would say no, because I believe in RF as long as possible and I don't think children who are outgrowing the SS1 will be big enough to FF, but it depends on your feelings about how long you want to RF.

If the Radian doesn't fit well, I'm not sure the SS1 will either. Try it out at BRU. :)

do you think it’s possible we’d be able to RF with the Radian at the 30 degree angle when DS grows out of the Snugride? I believe I read in my research somewhere that the Radian only works RF at 45 degrees, but it looks to me that you can adjust the seat to different angles.

I think so. As long as your child can sit up well and is comfortable at a lesser angle, that should be fine.

I have heard that some people can get the Radian to be at a 35* angle because of the slope of their seats.

(I’m not really interested in the Cosco Scenera.) I assume the Evenflo will be a lot less convenient for air travel – anyone know? Are there any other car seats that are convenient for air travel other than the Radian?

Have you tried the Triumph Advance in your car? It is big too. It may not fit properly either.

I know you said you aren't interested in the Scenera, but would you consider it as a temporary seat? It is FABULOUS for air travel.


If you use either a Snugride, SS1, or Scenera for the first few months (the SS1 and Scenera should last you more than a few months, though!), you could then either use your Radian or another seat like the Marathon/Decathlon/Boulevard.

[Ahzryn]

I agree, the rf radian in the center may be your best bet. Generally infant seats take up more room rf than convertibles, but you do need to be careful that an infant has enough recline in a convertible. The true test of angle is the child itself.....if their chin is on their chest or the head is falling forward, it's not deep enough.

:( about the "tech".

[AutoShopMama]

Also about checking the angle of the seat...a while back SouthPawBoston had a way of checking the angle of a seat with pictures you sent him, and there's an "angle-checker" out there used for contracting I think, but I've heard people use it for seat checking also. :)

Can you get to a Babies R Us or Baby Depot that will let you take different seats out to see how they fit in your car? That might be the most helpful - and then you'd be buying one you know fits.

And yes, you're right to keep your child RF for as long as possible. Many times people just don't know that it's better, but I'd question that tech's certification as well!!!

[papooses]

What year is your Jetta?

Other techs & myself could get the SS1 installed in the center of a 1994 Jetta, but not the Radian :o

[songdancer]

:thumbsdown:

I am returning my Evenflo Triumph Advanced, as I was very unhappy with the buckle. The buckle strap was very short and pinched my dd. The metal parts that clipped into the buckle flared out to the sides and poked her in the legs, and I can envision them being a safety hazard in a wreck.
My dd is only 38 pounds and 43" tall--and is very petite. The sides of the Triumph Advances also are not suited for younger children who will fall asleep, as their head falls onto their chest, since the top of the seat flares so wide. So I wouldn't recommend this seat. You won't get up to 50 pounds with it, as the short buckle stalk will make you change seats long before your child gets to that weight.

Oh, and this is a very large seat--I wouldn't want to carry it on an airplane. Out of the car seats that I have had (2 seats that I am replacing, her harnessed booster with back, and the Evenflo), the Evenflo is the largest out of all of them.

[TSquared]

Thank you all so much for the great feedback. You’ve given me a lot to consider. And please forgive another long post….I promise it will be the last one!

Okay, here’s where we are now based on some further investigation we did last night and your responses:

Using the folded up paper method,;) we found that in theory (didn't actually do it, it was late) we can get the seat at a good 45 degree angle IF we use the rear tether (DH didn’t do this before because he didn’t know where to hook it) AND have the front passenger seat all the way forward. I can deal with this scenario for the first 6 months or so and actually like the idea of riding in the back with the baby when he’s little. But definitely not feasible is the front seat all the way up for 2+ years, which is where I’m guessing the RF 33 lb. limit will get us to.

But, we also found that if we removed the headrest on the front passenger seat, move the front seat back a little to where it’s reasonably comfortable, and disengage the tether, we can get a more upright position. The top of the Radian will sort of lean against the back of the front passenger seat. So we’re going to try and get a definitive read on this angle to make sure it’s between 30-40 degrees and then we may be okay. If not, I guess we’ll return the Radian for now at least. At that point, we’ll definitely check out the SafeSeat, Scenera (you’ve convinced me this may be a great option), and the Uptown.

Bessmom: Yes, I’m pretty sure he was a certified tech. I got his name and no. from the nhtsa.dot.gov website. So I was shocked at his suggestions too. The child restraint laws in Illinois are pretty vague – 7 years and younger must be in a child restraint, while 8-15 years must use adult seat belt. That’s it. Maybe he was just using these as a guide.

I had considered the RA and according to the site on car/car seat compatability, it seems most Jetta owners get a good RF install with it. But I wasn’t sure it would do as well with a NB b/c other posts on this site have stated that none of the Britax have harness slots low enough to truly accommodate a NB and why I’d sort of zero’d in on these other options. So with the RA I *think* we’d still need the infant seat, but then it won’t have as long a life as some of the other convertibles out there.

About the Radian infant insert, I read a post on this site that you could order SK’s Comfy Soft and that it has been tested with the seat. I found one last night on Amazon and SKJP site, but it’s off-white, not gray, so I’m now not sure if it’s the same as the one on the 80. Thought I’d email SK once I get these other issues ironed out to verify and/or see if I could get exact one sold with the 80.

Adventure Mom: Definitely trying the Scenera and the Uptown…I’d never heard of this last one before.

Papooses: We’re gonna give the SafeSeat a shot, though I’m not convinced it’s going to work for us. At least one online Jetta-owner review I saw says that the front passenger seat must be pushed all the way forward for the SafeSeat to fit. IF that’s the case, may as well stick with the Radian. But I do want to check it out for myself.

Also, that’s a good point I hadn’t considered about the safety issues with installing/uninstalling a lot. This is really big, because I am NOT good at that sort of thing.

Susan: We were installing behind the passenger seat. Hmm….we had discussed the middle, but I don’t think DH actually tried it. Probably because he saw how easy the LATCH was versus the seat belt. :D You’re right, this is worth looking into. Glad to hear you got a good fit with the Scenera in the Jetta…I was beginning to think we were going to have to get a new car!

Patriot: I think you’re right, the Scenera may be a really good option for us. I like the idea of getting a better handle on DS height/weight and making the bigger purchase based on solid information rather than guessing. Also, we could actually take him in the store and see what HE likes (not what WE like) and what he looks comfy in.

Azhryn: Ok, yep, we’ll look at that middle of the seat option. And yes now I realize I need that full 45 degree angle…I didn’t know it had to do with blocked air passages, which is something really scary to think about with a NB.

Auto Shop Mama: Thanks for the tip on the angle-checker. DH thought he might be able to pick up something from his work that we can use….if not, I’ll look into those options.

Yep, there’s a BRU about 20-30 mins. away….they’re gonna hate me when want to check out about 10 seats! Also, I guess you can’t fully install them when you take them outside. But I guess you can get a pretty good idea if it’s gonna fit.

Papooses (#2): Our Jetta is a ’99, but it’s the new model. I believe in ’99 they put out both the older model (which is similar to the ’94) and one like ours, which is more like the body style they still have in the later models. But still I’m gonna give the SafeSeat a shot.

Songdancer: Thanks for that quick review on the Triumph….one less seat I’ll need to try at BRU!

Thanks again EVERYONE for all your great advice and for letting me “think out loud.”

You do a great service to all of us less-technical folks out here!:thumbsup:

[TSquared]

Just wanted to return and give our impressions when we tried out the car seats recommended in case other Jetta owners out there have similar issues.

SafeSeat: Checked this out at BRU and it actually did seem to fit in our Jetta on both the passenger side and in the middle/back. (Middle/back was the better option.) With the SafeSeat at 45 degrees, the front passenger would need to sit at about the same level of comfort as with the Radian at 30 degrees. Front passenger would need to be pushed fairly far forward, but not all the way. So I'm assuming that at 30 degrees, this seat would be do-able long term.

Cosco Scenera: Checked this one out, too, and it gave a much better fit than either of the others. The seat back is just slim enough to sort of fit between the gap of both front seats and is not too high like the Radian. With this seat installed back/middle, the passenger seat can be pushed almost all the way back and can even be reclined. :thumbsup: Since this one provided the most comfort for passenger, we decided to go with it and hope it's comfortable for DS as well.

Radian: As suggested, we did try it in the back/center and the fit, particularly at the 30 degree angle, was better back/center than passenger/back. As much as we loved the seat, we decided that it wasn't worth the comfort issues (and maybe the safety issues) of the front passenger to justify keeping the seat, given that the other options were better. We will look at this seat again when we are ready for FF. Hopefully, by that time, SK will make the Radian 80 with taller harness slots so that it is really comparable to the Britax Regent.

We didn't try the other one recommended (I think it was the Safety/Uptown or something like that) since it wasn't stocked at either BRU, Target or WalMart.